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In this episode of all about business, James sits down with Emma Jones, serial entrepreneur, Founder of Enterprise Nation, and the UK’s Small Business Commissioner. This is part one of a three-part masterclass on starting a business from scratch. Emma delivers practical, step-by-step advice on how to spot market gaps, validate ideas through smart market research, and build a focused niche.
Emma shares insight on why testing a business as a side hustle gives you the space to refine your model, how to navigate early-stage co-founder decisions, and why sharing your idea early brings crucial feedback rather than stolen IP.
This short episode gives a clear, realistic blueprint for knowing if your business idea is worth pursuing, leveraging free resources to test demand, and cultivating the daily resilience needed to keep going.
Timestamps (Video)
02:12 why start a business
08:27 test and hustle
10:27 common early mistakes
16:18 skills and resilience
18:40 co-founders and mentors
Follow James Reed on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/chairmanjames/
Follow Emma Jones on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emma-jones-8063536/
Find out more about Enterprise Nation and the support they offer here: https://www.enterprisenation.com/
Find out more about the Small Business Commissioner here: https://www.business.gov.uk/
Submit your application to Reed’s Entrepreneurs Fund for a chance to win a £20,000 grant: https://www.reed.com/entrepreneurs
Emma: [00:00:00] When you're thinking of starting a business, ask yourself three questions. First one, what is your passion, your hobby, your skill, and can it be turned into a way of making a living? Second one, have you spotted a gap in the market? So have you tried to look for a product or service that you maybe can't find?
Emma: In which case, there could be a gap in that market that you could fill. And then the third thing to ask yourself is
James: Welcome to a special Summer Shorts edition of All About Business. Over the next three episodes, we're doing something a little different. Rather than hearing from founders about how they built their businesses, we're focusing on how you can start one yourself.
James: Today, we're joined by Emma Jones, entrepreneur, founder of Enterprise Nation, and the UK's Small Business Commission. In this first episode, we'll explore why more young people than ever are considering entrepreneurship, the skills and commitment required to succeed, and how to come up with a business [00:01:00] idea that's worth pursuing.
James: Welcome to All About Business, with me, James Read, the podcast that covers everything about business, management, and leadership. Every episode, I sit down with different guests who have bootstrapped companies, masterminded investment models, or built a business empire. They're leaders in their field, and they're here to give you top insights and actionable advice so that you can apply their ideas to your own career or business venture
James: Well, today on All About Business, I couldn't be more delighted than to welcome Emma Jones to the studio. Um, she's really, uh, kindly agreed to do not one, but three podcasts in, in a series of what we're calling Summer Shorts. Um, we're not talking about short trousers here. We're talking about short episodes, and we're gonna look at the really key elements and aspects of [00:02:00] what it takes to set up a successful business.
James: Um, Emma is the ideal person to talk to about this because Emma is the small business commissioner and herself a serial entrepreneur. Um, Emma helps firms resolve issues such as late payments and, you know, issues they might face in business, and is also, through her own experience and what she's doing now, very well-placed to help us, um, advise and think about starting businesses.
James: You started your own business, Techn- Tech Locate. You then started another, Enterprise Nation, and you co-founded a really important enterprise campaign called Startup Britain. So I'm really looking forward to this conversation. Thank you so much for coming in and agreeing to do it, Emma. Welcome to the studio.
James: The first thing w- I wanted to cover is the kind of question, what problem can I solve? You know, what's it all about being an entrepreneur and starting a business?
Emma: Well, thank you, first of all, for having me on. And I guess the first thing, James, is kind of three for the [00:03:00] price of one in terms of these programs.
Emma: The first thing you've gotta do as an entrepreneur is always say yes to opportunities.
James: Yeah, and we love a good deal here. So three for the price of one sounds positive as well. So
Emma: when invitations come in, I was delighted to say yes to this one. Oh, well, thank you. So lovely to be here. So yes, uh, lots of people fortunately are still starting businesses in the UK.
Emma: Uh, you mentioned that one of my businesses was called Enterprise Nation. Uh, so I still truly believe in the concept of an enterprise nation, of people taking an idea, turning it into a way of making a living. And I don't need to say this to you, but some of the benefits that people feel when they do that is freedom, flexibility, and of course, hopefully, some financial reward as well.
Emma: But I think one of the main reasons people strive, uh, to become an entrepreneur and say, "Actually, maybe I won't get a day job," I feel very dangerous saying that to you in view of- I know,
James: you can
Emma: love Mondays as an entrepreneur ... in view of your profession. Yeah. Uh, but, uh- Yeah ... sometimes when people choose, uh, self-employment over employment, [00:04:00] they get all the benefits that that brings.
Emma: So a pleasure to be here to offer some tips to your listeners on how to go about doing it.
James: Freedom, flexibility, and, uh, hopefully a good living. That's what we're talking about.
Emma: Absolutely.
James: That's what's on the table. Um, so where do good business ideas actually come from?
Emma: Well, it's a great question and of course it's a question that everyone starts with when they think, "Can I become my own boss?"
Emma: So, uh, I always used to say to people, when you're thinking of starting a business, ask yourself three questions. First one, what is your passion, your hobby, your skill, and can it be turned into a way of making a living? Second one, have you spotted a gap in the market? So have you tried to look for a product or service that you maybe can't find, in which case there could be a gap in that market that you could fill.
Emma: And then the third thing to ask yourself is, have you seen somebody do something and you think, "Well, actually, I think I can do it better. I can do it cheaper, faster, in a better way"? If you ask yourself those three questions, that will [00:05:00] help you come up with an idea for a business. And just another bit of advice for people- Is when you start a business, of course you're very tempted, and rightly so, to say yes to every opportunity.
Emma: So you take on all the work, you hopefully win contracts. But the best businesses over time are the businesses that become quite niche businesses. So if you can think of that from the outset, so maybe your great passion in life is digital marketing, so maybe you start a business in digital marketing. You take customers from the corporate world, you take customers from the personal world, but over time, if you could niche that down to, say, maybe all I do is marketing for employment agencies, then of course you very quickly become the expert in that field.
Emma: So start out with an idea based on something you love, or having spotted a gap in the market, or something on which you feel you can improve, and over time, if you can, niche that idea down.
James: So become a- an expert in [00:06:00] a niche or a segment, so you- you're the solution to a particular problem.
Emma: Absolutely, because it's a great way to get customer loyalty.
Emma: So if you're the only person, go back to our digital marketeer who's only working for employment agencies, you build up lots of knowledge about that particular sector. So then employment agencies are coming to you, of course, for your digital marketing prowess, but actually they're also coming 'cause you're super connected to other people that they
James: want to know.
James: Yeah, I've gotta push back on you a little bit here, Emma, because I'd be worried that my good ideas would go to other employment agencies if I used someone who just did employment agencies.
Emma: Oh, well, this is where you have to- So how do you mitigate against that? Well, this is where you have to build, uh, c- client confidentiality, trust, and loyalty.
Emma: But it does- Yeah ... build where customers say, "You're the person we want to come to." And also, hopefully, it keeps your marketing costs low, because this is the other thing that we'll talk about, is when you're starting a business, you, again, the tendency is you want to be everywhere. But of course, if you've got a niche idea, you may only need to appeal to a niche audience, so it keeps your marketing [00:07:00] costs under control.
James: No, I can see that. So that's a good sort of overview about how you might start moving forwards. But how do you really sort of- Make sure it's an opportunity. I mean, what, what other things can you do to make sure the way you're headed really is an opportunity?
Emma: Well, the great thing to do is market research.
Emma: So hopefully once you've come up with your idea, lots of people then test it out on friends and family, so the great friends and family focus group. Of course, one thing you want to be a little bit careful of there is friends and family will always tell you that what you're doing is great. So then you've got to go a little bit wider than just asking your mom.
Emma: You've
James: obviously got nice friends and nice family. That's not what happens with me. We all- Well, may- maybe it was
Emma: good that you had the constructive criticism- Well, you could call it that ... from the outset.
James: Yeah, I guess.
Emma: Um, but market research, I think, is something that can get overlooked when people are starting out in business.
Emma: Uh, but there's great assets available. Of course, we have AI now. Uh, when I think back, James, to when I started my very first business when I was [00:08:00] 27, so it's quite a long time ago, uh, and I was based in Manchester at the time, and to do my market research, I went to Manchester Library, and you had to queue to get access to the computer terminals.
Emma: And so I would queue. You had an hour on the computer terminal. I'd do all my market research and then go back and queue again. Anyway, of course now people starting- Yes ... businesses have Google. So many people who are starting a business-
James: There's
Emma: so much at your fingertips ... are using AI. They're using, you know, whichever tool is their preference to say, "This is the business I'm thinking of starting.
Emma: Tell me what the competition looks like." But I would say there's also a great asset across the UK, and funnily enough, talking about libraries, um, the British Library in London, but there's also libraries across the UK have amazing, um, market information knowledge where you, for free, can walk in and get access to this.
Emma: So it's called Business and IP Centers. They're in lots of libraries across the UK, so as a budding entrepreneur, you can go and access all of that information. [00:09:00]
James: That's really interesting. I didn't know that. You said something that struck me, that you started your first business at the age of 27. Um, I think, you know, a lot of young people Um, maybe don't realize that so many businesses have been started by people in their 20s, you know, really successful businesses.
James: Um, but when you're that s- at that stage in life, you've got an idea. H- how
James: do you know whether it's sort of commercially viable, or how do you find out? What's the s-
Emma: Well, you just have to
James: test it ...
Emma: secret here? You have to get it out there. You just have to test it. You have to just do it.
James: So you have to just do it. You have to get started.
Emma: You have to get started, and, and this is always my advice, and actually just, uh, back to young people, and so many of us give advice based on our own personal experience.
Emma: And whenever I'm speaking to young people, I do give them advice to try and get a job first just so that they can get some training. So before starting my first business, I was very blessed to have five years at a firm called Arthur Andersen, which at [00:10:00] the time, I mean, it's sadly gone bust now, but at the time it was a big American professional services firm.
Emma: So for me, it helped me build confidence, a client network. I was taught how to deal with clients, and so of course having that kind of foundation then helped me start my first business. So for young people, if you can, go out and start building a network on somebody else's payroll, that can be beneficial.
Emma: But when it comes to testing will my idea work, uh, you know, I'm seeing amazing, uh, well, enterprising ideas from young people who of course are brilliant... And I, I shouldn't make generalizations, but young people tend to be very good at promoting themselves and their products and services online, so they get their ideas out online.
Emma: They get feedback from the crowd, from their community. But of course, if you're selling something that's kind of a product, food, drink, wellness, which are big sectors that are taking off with young people, just go out to events. Pitch it. Sell it. Hustle. You know, I love this word hustle, and this is what young people are [00:11:00] brilliant at doing, is getting out there and saying, "Do you like my product?
Emma: Do you like the color? Will you pay for this price?" And it's only through getting that customer interaction and reaction that you can keep on improving and know if you've got a business idea.
James: Did you know that there are nearly one million 18 to 24-year-olds who are currently not in education, employment, or training in the UK?
James: This is simply not good enough, and I want to do something about it. That's why Reed is launching a new initiative giving 20,000 pounds to young entrepreneurs to help them grow their small business. Visit reed.com/entrepreneurs to find out more. We want to support and encourage the next generation of entrepreneurs.
James: I think it's good, good advice to have a job first to learn, and I mean, you're gonna learn about a sector or an industry. Also, you learn a bit about how businesses work What's good and what's not so good, and how important colleagues are. And, and hiring [00:12:00] the right people, I might stress. Um, so what's the biggest mistake people make at this stage?
James: You know, asking themselves, is this a real business? What, what's, what, what are some of the common mistakes you might see? Well- That people can, you know, be careful
Emma: of ... I'd say one mistake is people who give up too early, actually. Uh, so, you know, one of the things is to just kind of keep on going. But, um,
James: what- What is too early?
Emma: Well, good question. Too early is if, say, you've been trading for six months and you still haven't made a sale, maybe there's something you can do. But this is another word that's come into the business vernacular which never used to exist, is the word pivot, and this is what young people, again, are brilliant at doing.
Emma: I, I was with a young entrepreneur a couple of weeks ago called Johnny Grubin, who started a business called SOAPOST, and he pivoted, and when, even when he tells the story of his business, he said, "I started out with one idea. That didn't work. I pivoted. I've done this," and he's now found the thing that commercially works.
Emma: One other thing, um, I feel, and, and years ago when I was running [00:13:00] Enterprise Nation, I used to run Start Up Saturday events. So on a Saturday I'd gather 20, 25 people, and we'd all start a business in the space of a day. And a couple of things that always used to come out, and I used to think you know, this is almost what not to do, is at the beginning of the session, we'd go round and I'd say to everyone, "Share with me the idea that you're thinking of starting for your business."
Emma: And the odd person would say, "I'm not sharing my idea." And I'd say, "Why are you not sharing it?" And they say, "Well, because what about if the person next to me steals my idea?" And I think that can be a mistake early on, is not sharing what it is that you're looking to do with others. Now, I understand if it's something that no one's ever done before and you have patents pending, you have to be very careful in t- in terms of whom you tell.
Emma: But actually the more that you socialize your idea, the more you'll get feedback on it. So don't be nervous about telling people what it is that you're thinking about doing. Mistake number one. And the second one, I'll just add, was another experience that [00:14:00] came from Start Up Saturday, is I will never forget, a young lady came in, and again, everyone had gone round saying their ideas, and this young lady said to me, she said, um, "I know I want to start in the food and drink business."
Emma: She said, "But can you tell me what is going to be the most profitable thing for me to do, because I have no particular passion in any particular category?" And I think what you have to do when starting a business And again, James, this will be well known to you. If you can build a business on your passion or doing what you love, it really helps in the hard times because when you've got to put in the long hours, when you have to get up every day and put that commitment, if it's something that is a mission or a social purpose or something that you feel passionate about, that's the thing that helps keep you going.
Emma: So I would say base the business on doing what you love, share that idea with people as early as you can, and then what we've just said, which is get it out there and start selling. I
James: mean, if you love something, you're likely to be good at it, [00:15:00] aren't you? Because being good at it m- helps you to love it even more.
James: So that's becomes a sort of circular positive, I think. So I would agree with that.
Emma: It also shows when you're with customers, they can tell that you love doing what you're doing and therefore it makes it easier for them to buy.
James: Yeah, and enthusiasm's infectious, so totally agree. Um- What other questions should you ask yourself before investing time and money into starting a business?
James: Uh, what other things should be on someone's mind if they're thinking of becoming an entrepreneur?
Emma: Well, I guess it is the commitment, and one of the things that we have seen, which I've loved to see over the past kind of decade, is people testing things first. So the side hustle, the rise of the side hustle, people holding onto the day job or even young people who are studying college or university.
Emma: So they're doing this by day, and then they're testing this entrepreneurial idea at nights and weekends, and this is one of the great things about starting a business now. You can leverage technology. Your business can be running whilst you're doing something else, so it's [00:16:00] a great way to test it. So other questions that I guess, uh, business owners should be asking themselves is, do I want to commit to this full time?
Emma: So is it something that I want to turn from a side hustle into a full-time business? But this is where it comes back to the freedom and flexibility that we mentioned at the beginning. I've seen many business owners start small businesses, uh, I hate this term, but they call it a lifestyle business, where the business is just run around their life, uh, particularly relating to women, actually.
Emma: So when women start businesses around young children, they might start it as a lifestyle business, but of course then as the children grow, they've got more time to invest. They may have more money to invest in the business, and you've got the freedom and flexibility to scale the business according to your life.
Emma: Why, why
James: do you hate the term lifestyle business?
Emma: Because it connotates that it's just a, a hobby, and I think anyone who's starting a business clearly takes it seriously enough to take it into commercial reality. It's not used so much anymore but it used [00:17:00] to be, and dare I say I now work for the government.
Emma: It used to be an oft-used government term
James: Oh, really?
Emma: Uh, but not
James: so much anymore. Oh, well slightly, slightly dismissive. 'Cause the other way I'm thinking of it is if, if you've got a business that supports a good lifestyle, what's wrong with that?
Emma: Absolutely, and of course this is the
James: thing- That you enjoy doing.
James: I mean, you don't have to build BP or something. I mean, that's the
Emma: case. And it, it's the majority of businesses in the UK- Yeah ... and you'll know these stats, 5.6 million businesses operating, the huge majority of them less than five employees. It is the founder and of course again, incredible how technology has enabled this to happen, but quite often now business owners Again, I feel bad saying this to James Read, but business owners are not necessarily employing full-time staff, but they're looking for contractors and a flexible
James: workforce.
James: Oh, we can help with all of that as well. We can help with a flexible workforce, temporaries, contractors, permanent hires. I could go through the whole list, and we, and we do so very well. So, so what does it actually take? Um, what's the, the, this is what skills matter the most for an [00:18:00] embryonic entrepreneur?
Emma: Well, I guess the first thing to say is absolutely skills are required, but anyone can be an entrepreneur is, is really kind of like a message I want to land because some people... And again, when I'm interviewed on my entrepreneurial journey, I was very fortunate to have a mum who ran restaurants, so I had self-employment in my family.
Emma: But anyone can be an entrepreneur. You don't have to have self-employment. You don't have to have genes given to you to be entrepreneurial. So I do feel that anyone can pick up the skills. And what's required is coming up with that good idea, continuing to refine that idea, the ability to go out and pitch it to others.
Emma: And this is the thing, life as an entrepreneur or a business owner, you're always hustling. You're pitching to either hire people into your business, you're pitching for clients, so that's a good skill to have. And by the way, if it's not your skill, this is why we're seeing lots of businesses start with co-founders.
Emma: Because lots of people have said to me, "I'm an introvert. You know, the idea [00:19:00] of going out and pitching anything terrifies me." To which I would say, "Well, either try and learn those skills or find a co-founder who's got them because then you'd hopefully be the perfect complement." So have a great idea, the ability to get out there, and then I think this is where it comes into, again, an oft used word at the moment is resilience.
Emma: So the ability to get up each day. I spoke, uh, last week at an amazing event called The Business of Pets Conference, which was for lots of businesses in the pet industry. And before I spoke, I turned up where there were a panel of pet businesses talking, and one of the owners said something brilliant, which is so true.
Emma: She said, she said, "As a small business owner, you have to learn to bend like bamboo." And I think this is very true is small businesses operating now have moved from kind of one crisis to the next over the past decade. And you've got to have flexibility, you've got to have resilience to just weather those storms and keep on trading.
James: Reeds are [00:20:00] quite good at bending- There
Emma: you
James: go ... like bamboos, yeah. Um, so you, you, you said a few things there that I was very interested in you. I mean, I think it all begins with an idea, but I mean, you said that, and I would agree. You've gotta have an idea. Um, you then said that, that you might want to get a co-founder alongside.
James: Did you do that yourself?
Emma: So I did for my first business, so I- But
James: not for your second.
Emma: Well, I have a very big take on this. So my first business was myself and a, and a guy called Adam Breeze, and, and we had a very quick business 'cause we sold it within two years. And I, I had, then had an 18-month lock-in with the company that bought us, and over that 18-month period, I would go back to my co-founder, we were based in Manchester, and virtually every week I would pitch him a new idea and say, "Right, this can be our next venture."
Emma: And every time he said, "Nope, that's not what I want to do." So Enterprise Nation, which was my next business, essentially I founded on my own because he didn't want to come in with me. Right. [00:21:00] And so again, for those, I have lots of advice, whether you're a co-founder, it can be amazing to find someone who has got complementary skills because as a sole founder, you know, all of the questions are going around in your own head, and therefore for sole founders, I think it's really important to get a mentor, to get some kind of advisors, an advisory board- I mean, '
James: cause potentially-
James: to get that support ... you're giving up a lot of equity. I mean, if you, if you, you have a really good idea and it becomes a really good business, if you, if you don't have a co-founder, that's entirely yours, isn't it?
Emma: But lots of people say that if you have a co-founder, you'll grow quicker and better. Yeah.
James: So good question.
James: So is there evidence for that?
Emma: Um, I would not... Well, I think the, the only evidence you can say is if you look at a lot of businesses that are starting these days, the Sunday Times just, uh, uh, profiled the fastest growing companies in 2026. What I don't think anyone's done, but I think it would be really interesting if they could, is how many of those businesses are co-founders.
James: Yeah, it'd be interesting to research. I mean, quite a lot of siblings go into business together. [00:22:00] Yeah. 'Cause obviously there's a sort of strong bond of trust-
Emma: Trust ...
James: which I think is interesting. So can entrepreneurship be learned?
Emma: It can, and in fact, I think entrepreneurs are always learning, but learning on the job.
Emma: Whether it can be learnt in an academic setting, I'm not so sure. I think entrepreneurship is the best way of learning it is just by getting out there and doing it.
James: So if you want to learn how to be an entrepreneur, get started and you'll learn.
Emma: You have to be one. Yeah. What I would say, and the government has a really good program called Help to Grow Management, if you're a business owner and you've started out by d- doing all the things in your business, but then you say, "I need to become an expert in certain areas," becoming a better manager or leader, I think you can learn, and there is a great course called Help to Grow Management that small businesses can go on.
Emma: Uh, but I think the, the brass tactics of starting and growing a business-
James: Well, and the CMI, of course, supports people- Absolutely ... moving from what they call accidental managers into conscious leaders, which is really good too. Yeah. [00:23:00] So yes, management I'm sure can be learned, but I, I think you're right, entrepreneurship is probably learned on the job.
James: So, um, what's more important, passion or resilience?
Emma: Oh, is it, uh, uh, well, now, can I say both?
James: No.
Emma: Oh, you ha- I have to choose one?
James: Oh, you can try and say both.
Emma: I mean, I, I-
James: They're obviously both important, but if you had to ju- if you could only have one, which would it be?
Emma: Ooh, I'd have to go with the passion, mainly because I think it's the passion that keeps you going.
James: Okay. I'll go with resilience. It's the resilience that keeps you going. Well, there you go. We've got both covered . But the, the, the, the thing is to keep going, though, isn't it? That's sort of whichever, whichever of those it is that keeps you going, that's the key. You
Emma: gotta keep going.
James: You gotta keep going.
James: Um, and how much commitment does it really require to be an entrepreneur?
Emma: As much or as little as you want to put in as the founder. Uh, so if you're a founder with employees, it takes a lot of commitment. You've got salaries to pay. You've got a product to refine. You've got customers to keep happy. So it's a big commitment, which is [00:24:00] why, and, and Enterprise Nation, so kind of my last company, was very much set up on the basis of how do you surround founders with the support they need?
Emma: Because, you know, you're in it every day, seven days a week. It is constant improvement in the business, and so you need support around you to do that. So yeah, it's no light task starting and growing your own business.
James: No, I mean, I, I've had guests on the podcast who've sort of mortgaged their homes, worked for years without making sales, sort of taken no salary.
James: I mean, they've made huge sacrifices.
Emma: So this, one of the things- What do you think about
James: that?
Emma: One of the things that I've started since coming into my government role is every month I run what's called an SME Safari. So I take a group of civil servants to meet entrepreneurs in their real-life trading setting, so that's why it's called a safari.
Emma: And last month- Is that
James: what the civil servants think of us?
Emma: Well, this, this thing, I'm, I- It's like going
James: into a Serengeti in
Emma: a Jeep. I am get- I'm getting told off for this term. What? [00:25:00] Um, so we may have to change it. Well, I'm a lion as they're coming. I know. I know. Yeah. Quite a few regions have said, "Do you think we're animals?"
Emma: And I said, "No, that's not the case." It's more the principle of civil servants getting out of Whitehall and, and office buildings-
James: It's a jolly good thing. I think it's a good initiative. I like the term ...
Emma: to actually meet them. Yeah. So last month we were in Newcastle, and this is exactly what we heard. Of the four entrepreneurs we met, three had remortgaged their homes.
Emma: And so we are incredibly aware the risk-taking that goes on. But what really astonish- not astonishes me, but what really drives me is entrepreneurs will tell us their story. They've had their ups and downs. You know, they're feeling challenges at the moment. They've remortgaged homes. They've taken risk.
Emma: And at the end of the day, if you say to them, "So tomorrow will you give it up and go and get a job?" And they will say, "No, I'm gonna keep going." So this is where it comes back to whatever the sacrifice is, these people put in the hard work, [00:26:00] and they just keep going, and that's what the UK's got to be grateful for.
James: So that's very interesting. Do you think first-time founders underestimate that? I mean, it's a-
Emma: I think you can. I, I remem- so when I started my first business at 20, 27, I distinctly remember a really experienced businessman saying to me, "I'm happy to become your mentor." And I'm quite embarrassed about this, but I remember saying to him, "Oh, no, no, I don't need one of those.
Emma: This is gonna be really straightforward." And so of course, and, and when you're starting a business, you do go into it with rose-tinted glasses of, "I've got a great idea." You get some early wins, so you're delighted, but scaling a business is tougher than probably you think. But again, this is why it's super helpful, and when I was scaling Enterprise Nation, I read a huge amount of books of people who've been there and done it because, of course, now we've got the benefit of people who have done this and are sharing their experience.
Emma: I surrounded myself with good people and a board of advisors who could help. [00:27:00] Uh, I took on angel investment from someone who also kind of came in to support. So it is tough, and the growing reality of that, you know, comes to pass, and you realize that as the founder, but there is so much support available to help get you through it.
James: Thank you very much, Emma. That concludes our first short, which is all about what does it take to be an entrepreneur. I think that's excellent advice. Thank you, James.
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